Skye chooses

[ldlbfn]

Pepperdine over UNM and san Diego. Heard this morning on radio on way to work.

[Dr.M]

Assuming that she was high on UNM's want list, that is not good news. We've been so up from the men's recruiting that we hope for more from the women's program. I wonder what it would take? Maybe an assistant like Chris Walker who has big-time connections.

[txlobo95]

Maybe an assistant like Chris Walker who has big-time connections.

Maybe. I'll be curious to see the recruits they sign in Nov. If we don't show an improvement over the last two years, I suspect we will need to hire an assistant coach that can bring much better players into the fold.

Last year we only had one freshman make any real contributions, Amy Beggin. That will need to change this year or this team will be in trouble.

Remember, recruiting is a lagging indicator. Last years seniors were recruited by other coaches. This years' freshman and the ones we sign this fall are all on this set of assistant coaches.

We've only signed one top 100 recruit ever, and she was locally grown. At some point, if this program is to have any sustained NCAA success the recruiting has to "Materially" improve. We've got one of the best x's & o's coach in the game, now just need the talented players to run his system.

Hopefully, we will all be pleasantly suprised in Nov.:D

If not, then I hope we can make an adjustment to raise our level of recruiting for next Nov.

[ThickLobo]

Maybe. I'll be curious to see the recruits they sign in Nov. If we don't show an improvement over the last two years, I suspect we will need to hire an assistant coach that can bring much better players into the fold.

Last year we only had one freshman make any real contributions, Amy Beggin. That will need to change this year or this team will be in trouble.

Remember, recruiting is a lagging indicator. Last years seniors were recruited by other coaches. This years' freshman and the ones we sign this fall are all on this set of assistant coaches.

We've only signed one top 100 recruit ever, and she was locally grown. At some point, if this program is to have any sustained NCAA success the recruiting has to "Materially" improve. We've got one of the best x's & o's coach in the game, now just need the talented players to run his system.

Hopefully, we will all be pleasantly suprised in Nov.:D

If not, then I hope we can make an adjustment to raise our level of recruiting for next Nov.
I don't think it is fair to assume that last year's incoming class did not include very good players. They had some veteran players ahead of them which in part limited their PT. It seems to me, and it is just my opinion, that the talent level of the incoming freshmen has improved almost every year. I think that overall Flan is bringing in better athletes and more talented players. And since there are quality players in every class, it makes it difficult for younger players to break into the line-up until they learn the system. He does not usually play freshmen a lot (with a few notable exceptions) yet many players have developed to make large contributions to the program in their upperclass campaigns. So, I think that the verdict on any incoming class must be held until at least those players' junior seasons.

Having said that, I sure would like to see a couple of sure fire blue chippers come to UNM. I think Flan could coach a team with the type of talent that they regularly get in the BCS conferences to a national championship.

[ldlbfn]

Going back, trying to think real fast here, several freshmen have made key contributions during Flan's tenure. Sometimes out of necessity in the early years. Jody Cory, Jennifer Williams to think of a couple. Jody was a slow guard, Jenn one of those tweeners because of size and ability that got passed by fairly quickly when looking at the way the women's game started growing then. Kristy, Molly, Susan all made big contributions as freshmen; Kristy leaving IMO set the program back some expecially after Brit couldn't play with the leg problems. Jordan, Mandi, Lindsey, Stephanie Shaw, Katie, Dionne, probably some I'm forgetting off the top of my head. The last couple classes probably the least any freshmen have played under Flan. We will have to wait to see how much Eileen, Val, Christian, and Georonia have improved. This year's incoming class(looking at who else was recruiting them)may be the best "on paper" classes coming is in a while. Amanda B. recruited by some PAC 10 schools and UNLV, Kelsey by Texas Tech and some other Big 12 schools(my concern with her is the same as with Angela and Val-foot quickness in the paint, speed in getting upa nd down the court). Transfer Amanda A. was recruited by some Big 12 and Big East schools-going to Syracuse her first couple years. Porsche, from reports from someone who watched her play, has good speed and quickness(may come in and be the quickest player on the team-needs to improvestrength). Jessica the best player from a program in a small state. From pics i have seen, seems to have a Lindsey type build-will she be that kind of player. Nikki we have to wait a year on and see how she rehabs.

As many know, I have been a proponent of getting someone with connections or a name that can get some players. As we have seen on the men's side, interest has exploded this off season. Have to see what happens on the court the next couple years. But on the women's side; just n conference it seems like Wyoming now with the Australian connection, BYU, TCU, and especially now San Diego is outrecruiting UNM. Have to see how it plays out on the floor. Check out Burn's staff. Well-known names in wbball circles. And Katie Kern, I have always felt she could become a very good recruiter, a sI think the same of Tiffany. I ask again(for probably a teen number of times)if the rumor about Griffith wanting to come here was true, could that have effected-especially top post players-the talent level that would have been interested?? An Ashley Gayle, Monique Oliver, Brit Griner, etc. might possibly be interested in being tutored by Yo?? Only reason Chelsea Hopkins is giving Temple a look is because she thinks she can learn a great deal about playing PG from Dawn Staley. And another concern I kinda have is we have a male heavy staff. IMO, a young energetic female with connections or a name that can attract players would be a positive.

[LIDOakaLJT]

Four (4) of the last 5 Conference tournament championships and 6 straight NCAA tournament appearances!!! :D

[txlobo95]

Four (4) of the last 5 Conference tournament championships and 6 straight NCAA tournament appearances!!! :D


Terrific stuff, but it's in the past and this is a new year. As they say, when you start resting on your previous accomplishments you immediately start falling behind. Also, recruiting is a lagging indicator, meaning, the players that won those championships were recruited long ago. We won't know for a couple of years, just how good or bad last years and this years classes will be.


I don't think it is fair to assume that last year's incoming class did not include very good players.


Yes, it is a fair statement. Coach mentioned on more than one occassion last year, he wanted to get all of the freshman legitimate playing time, but also stated they had to "earn their pt" it would not just be given away to get experience. Only one freshman stepped forward and took the challenge and earned playing time, Amy Beggin. Any other freshman that played was very spotty pt at best and no other freshman made an impact on the teams success. Val had one or two really good games, but outside of that, did not really make an impact.

At this point in time, we're not even sure Amy is a "very good player". She was certainly a capable back-up last year, but was not relied on for her offense, as we had Katie, Julie and Dionne firing on all cylinders and carrying the bulk of the offensive load. Now that Amy will need to be more offensive minded, can she again step forward this year and show that she had a good all-around game?

We have had several freshman that have been able to contribute and be role players off the bench in their first year. Abbie, Katie, Mandi, Dionne (led team in scoring her freshman year), etc.

Out of 5 freshman on last year's team and only one freshman played in every game and the only player that played more than 7 minutes per game. That means we only had 20% of our recruiting class make any decent contributions last year.

Sorry, but I can't see how a reasonable person would be able to say that last year's class was a successful recruiting class. As a comparison, if we only have 1 freshman this year play more than 7 minutes per game, we will have a difficult year this year.

The soph's will be relied upon this year, so we'll see if they have made dramatic improvements over last year.

The last time we had an impact freshman was Dionne. We haven't had impact freshman in quite a while now. Amy was certainly a capable back-up last year, and did good most of the time she filled in.

If this program is to truly take a step forward, we need to have players come in year 1 and have the ability to make an impact immediately. Dionne average double digit points in her freshman year, and we haven't had a freshman make even close to that level of impact since then..

This year will certainly be interesting. The November signing period will be just as interesting. I just hope they have a couple of rabbits in a hat they pull out in Nov.

Coach can coach up any players, even some that really are DII level players, Lindsay Black, etc. to be nice role players and maybe even spot starters.

However, he won't be able to coach forever, and I just hope we are able to get multiple legit high level top 200 national D1 recruits on the team, before he retires.

Porche Torrance is a legit Top 200 national player (rated by Blue Star), but is the only one we've had in quite a while. She will need to greatly improve her strength, but will be able to contribute this year, no question. By her sophomore year, with added strength she should really blossom into a player that can be a more dominate player for the team for her last 3 years.

[txlobo95]

Having said that, I sure would like to see a couple of sure fire blue chippers come to UNM. I think Flan could coach a team with the type of talent that they regularly get in the BCS conferences to a national championship.

I'm not sure he would be able to win a national title, per se, but I agree 100%, if UNM had legit blue chippers, we could book our tickets to the final four.

If Elaine Elliot could lead Utah within 1 FT of the final four, coach Flan, will legit blue chip talent could coach a team to a final four and I really hope he is able to do so.

The most important cog in that puzzle is a blue chip center. Watch out for Xavier in the next few years. Let's see how much success they enjoy after landing two of the top centers in the last two classes.

Maybe coach Alford can impart some recruiting wisdom to the WBB staff to show them "how to close the deal" in getting these national players. :nerdy

[ldlbfn]

Four (4) of the last 5 Conference tournament championships and 6 straight NCAA tournament appearances!!! :D

Yes, good accomplishment. Regular season-two ties in that span of time. A couple times I think a third place finish kinda putting the pressure to win the tourney to get to the Dance. Without the conference tourney-might only have a couple appearances.

[sandia mt]

As many know, I have been a proponent of getting someone with connections or a name that can get some players.



enough already. You could start to sound like someone we all refer to as the scarecrow if you keep it up. Yeah it would have been nice to have a big name on staff (maybe - as we all know that doesn't always mean wins), but we have who we have and we have done pretty well. I for one would not care to have Dawn Staley here. I was not impressed when her team played in the Pit and as I recall Flanagans team won.

[ThickLobo]

I'll restate that some major blue chippers would be nice. However, I like winning year after year. Look at Utah last year - once their big guns graduated they went down. BYU was not so hot without Ambrosia. San Diego State - not accomplishing much for all the "great coaches and recruits". All Flan does is win - how awful!

[txlobo95]

some major blue chippers would be nice. However, I like winning year after year. Look at Utah last year - once their big guns graduated they went down.


That's interesting and I guess it depends on your perspective of what constitutes winning. If that means the conference tourney, bingo, we've been on the money on that one, especially over the last 5 years, by winning 4 in that time. Utah has won 2 tourney titles and BYU and CSU have won one each since the inception of the MWC in 1999-00. We are clearly the dominate MWC tourney team.

If it means winning a regular season MWC crown, we are well behind Utah. BYU won it outright the last 2 years, we shared the crown with Utah the two years prior to that and Utah won 3 of the previous 4 outright, with only CSU breaking that string.

Since the inception of the MWC, Utah has 5 conferences titles, 2 shared. BYU has 2 outright conference titles, UNM has two shared titles, not yet an outright conference title, yet... and CSU had one outright conference title. That gives this year's Lobo team certainly something to shoot for, a clear outright title! :D

As you say, if you like winning year after year, we have been the model of consistency, not finishing any lower than a tie for 3rd place since the inception of the MWC.

If you mean, how many NCAA wins we've had recently, say since 2001, which includes our sweet 16 run and one other win against Florida last year for a total of 3 wins and one sweet 16.

Meanwhile, Utah leads the MWC with 7 NCAA wins in that time span, including an elite 8 last year and a sweet 16 run in 2001.

TCU is second in the MWC with 5 wins, all first round wins. BYU is in third place with us, with 3 total wins, including a sweet 16 run in 2001-02. CSU had one win in 2001 and UNLV made the tourney in 2002 without a win, and neither team has made it back since then. Just a note, CSU did go to the sweet 16 in 99. The MWC had 4 diff teams make a sweet 16 run from 99 - 03.

Again, clearly Utah is the class of the MWC not only in terms of total NCAA wins, but how deep their runs were in the tourney. TCU has made the most consecutive NCAA's at 7 (but should they have really gone last year?) We currently have 6 consecutive trips to the NCAAs. (2nd best in conference)

In the late 90's & early 2000's, Utah, UNM, BYU & CSU all reached the sweet 16 and then Utah last year made it to the elite 8. That's 4 different teams from the MWC making it to at least the sweet 16 and TCU before last year had won 5 first round games in 6 consecutive years in the NCAA's and failing to win that second game every single year. Last year they ran into a buzz-saw in Ole Miss and Armintie Price.

Point is, this conference has had 5 different teams with NCAA success in the last 8 years, and the conference is getting more competitive with Wyoming returning a very solid team this year and SDSU on the upswing. (drastically improved their RPI last year over the previous year and have a top 50 national player as a freshman this year)

So the question is, are recruiting blue chippers and winning consistently year after year not cohesive and mutually beneficial goals? Wouldn't blue chippers not only help you win, but help you win big in the NCAA's?

One thing that has kept the consistency from year to year is the top notch coaching we have in place and the team chemistry this staff tries to develop each year. If you were to give our coaches the top talent, then I think we dominate the regular season titles as we have the tourney titles which then translates into big-time success in the NCAAs.

As we have seen on the men's side of things, we can't take the top notch coaching for granted, just look at the previous two men's coaches. UNM currently has a top notch coach and would almost be a waste of top coaching talent if we are not able to provide coach Flan at least some level of top notch or close to top notch players to work with before he retires.

Can you imagine what our coaches could do with this team if we had 4 top 100 players (say a FR, SO, JR & SR) to balance out the classes?

I'm only bringing the recruiting thing up as coach Flan has brought up the issue on several different occasions and quite frankly, it is the biggest key to success on the court, besides raw coaching ability.

We'll see how it all plays out this year, but I must admit, I am slightly concerned knowing Dionne and Brandi, that have both been wonderful players and key players on this team for several years now, will both graduate this year.

At this point, I can't readily see enough players that are ready to step up into big-time starting roles out of our current crop to maintain our current level of success. I'm crossing my fingers and hoping there are at least a couple of players in this year's freshman crop that can be big-time players for us down the road. I'm pretty sure there is at least one, that will be big-time for us. I'm hoping there are others.

[RedPitSea]

Nice post txlobo, points on that one.

[Lobodawg92]

I see some of our incoming players as being very solid prospects. The recruiting class coming in was perhaps the strongest we have ever had. I am somewhat concerned for this year and next due more to our youth than anything else. Flan is a fundamentalist, and these young ladies will be where they need to be in 2 years for sure I think. The road there is questionable.

As far as being critical about the kids Flanigan has recruited, I can't. The success of the women's program has been phenomenal. We compete year in and year out for the conference crown. We get to the NCAA's and win. We are often ranked. I remember a men's program that we were always complaining about that was not even this successful, and it sure seems to me we didn't do ourselves any good after running that coach out of town. :-)

Blue chippers would be nice, and Flan has said he wants better players. However, he has good talent now. I think Kast may be a major factor before her career is over. Who really knows what we have right now. When you have 10 (count'em 10 I say) freshman and sophomores, it is difficult to say what you really have in the bag. Could be great, could be duds, but, based on what this coach has brought to the program, I am excited to see what develops. Based on what I have seen, I wouldn't be surprised to see a top 20 program come out of this down the road, getting to the NCAA's and winning, and being good role models for my kid, a program that gets good grades and has kids that keep out of trouble. For me, Flannigan has the keys and free reign to recruit whomever he can, and when he finally lands some of those "blue chippers", I hope they don't come with the baggage some of them do. Last thing we need is an attitude coming from the ladies program.

Wanting more success? Sure. Content where we are at? Sure. It is possible to be both!

Go Lobos!

[ThickLobo]

"Maybe coach Alford can impart some recruiting wisdom to the WBB staff to show them "how to close the deal" in getting these national players."

I think that a successful men's program will help recruiting on the women's side. I think that a better men's program will also help women's attendance. Rising tides float all boats (or something like that).

[ldlbfn]

San Diego State - not accomplishing much for all the "great coaches and recruits". All Flan does is win - how awful!
As I stated. SDSU put a scare into some teams some games playing a lot of frosh last year. Paris Johnson coming in this year. Some names interested in SDSU in a couple future classes(I know, I know if they land them)could put SDSU in the top 20. As I have also stated, with the youth they have this year, I expect to se big improvement from them this year. Contend for a title yet?? Maybe, maybe not. But the following season, unless some things change with some teams, they are my early pick to contend if not win the conference the following season.

I will also repeat this. I have had season tickets since Flan's 2nd season. Thought he should have been the choice the first time when the program was reinstituded. Will cotinue to support the program. If the goal is to stay where it is, as I've said, fine, status quo. If it is to be a legit top 10 team, and as tx has said as well as others now(especially Flan himself lately), recruiting needs to take a step or two up. With strides Legerskei has made, Judkins is always contending at BYU, SDSU is making strides, will Elliot bounce back??, staying in top half of conference not going to get easier. Better for the conference overall?-probably. Unless knocking each other off hurts in getting teams to the dance. Lots of people I talk to that have had season tickets for a long time are wondering if this is as far as the program can go. We're just New Mexico" syndrome?? I don't know. If this is it, fine.

Those that know me know that, yes, I am a fan and will continue to be. But is it the most important thing in my life?? Far from. Just enjoy discussing different views. And I have always enjoyed sports. In my younger days I would even say that sports was my god, not God. If people have read my post in the general discussion forum, will see where by far my biggest personal priority is. Some people look at some coaches almost as a god that can do no wrong-and that it is wrong to question any decisions about a programs or teams. If people are going to be so offended by my views, I will not post on boards anymore. Don't get into the name calling or trash talk junk. Not my intent. I enjoy most the dialogues, know people have different views(we're all different and see some things differently-but I don't go off getting all upset because someone disagrees. If people read entirety of my posts and not just pick what they want, they will see how I respect the players as people that have been brought in-and that as I have said is more important than being a top ten team. But in discussing what are the goals of programs, there will be views on what needs to be done. When I look at things like that on a national level, I look at staffs, backgrounds, etc. Maybe the small population of New Mexico will not allow some programs to advance further than they have in today's time and society. Guess we will see.

[LIDOakaLJT]

THANK YOU LOBODAWG92 --- EXCELLENT POST!!! :D


GO LOBOS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Lobodawg92]

Woa ldlbfan (I think I spelled that right ;-), I don't think anyone was name calling. I have read many of your posts, and appreciate your input, as I do most. None of us always agree. I don't quite agree with the "we need a more prominate coach" philosphy. I see Flan getting kids who are willing to work hard, and fit into the system and the group we already have. Some programs sacrifice that for so called talent, that doesn't fit, and usually causes more problems than good. If my post offended you, sorry, just I am really happy with where we are, and the prospect of getting even better seems quite likely to me with the recruits we have in house! Also, Flan has earned the right to free reign in most aspects as far as I am concerned. :-)

Go Lobos! Go Flan! Peace ldl

[Lobodawg92]

THANK YOU LOBODAWG92 --- EXCELLENT POST!!! :D


GO LOBOS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thank you LIDO, maybe some day my rep power will get up there with yours! :eek:

Gosh, I love this time of the year. Football is actually starting off strong, and the promise of Lobo hoops around the corner, life is good. :-) :>

[ThickLobo]

For the record, I wasn't trash talking you and I truly appreciate your perspective (always fair and reasoned). I was simply pointing the "what could be" of other programs vs. the proven success of what we have. I also don't think that our program has peaked and I think Flan can take it higher. He's a competitive, proven winner who is always looking for ways to win and get better.

I also think that the talent has improved and will continue to do so. The incremental increase in talent may not be so visible to the fans partly due to the talent of the players ahead of incoming players (were Julie, Brand, Dionne or Katie going to sit significant minutes to make way for underclassmen last year?).

I can understand why some folks would look around the conference and wonder if other programs are catching up with us. I hope they are - it only helps us to be in a strong conference. But UNM is still the envy of the conference and I don't think any of the up-and-comers have reached UNM's level of consistent winning yet. The program continues to improve on all levels (except maybe attendance which I believe was hit hard by big price increases two years ago).

Again, we should continue to strive for the best talent possible and I hope that the discussion of this by fans lets the coaches know that we fans expect that. However, I see it happening - perhaps not at the blue chipper level that we'd like (yet), but talent levels are improving. With our coach we can beat MWC teams that seemingly attract higher ranked players.

That all being said, I'd sure like us to progress to the point where we could make a strong run in the NCAA's and it will take one or two special players to do that.

[txlobo95]

Very well stated post, Thick.


That all being said, I'd sure like us to progress to the point where we could make a strong run in the NCAA's and it will take one or two special players to do that.

I'm hoping that once we get the first "special" player, that others will follow her lead. It's pretty amazing what an avalanche effect it could have on a program.