Tiger Woods

[Mark]

Im sure a fair amount of you saw this guy come back. Unbelievable the last 2 days considering his recent surgery and you can tell the dudes in major pain.Best athlete on the planet hands down.

[LoboMike]

Golf... :zzzzz

[Burro lobo]

true that Mike!!

[Lobograd82]

Best golfer, yes. Best athlete on the planet? Not even in the ballpark.

Golf is a tough "game" but requires no great strength, no speed, no thowing or jumping, or great coordination. You don't even have to be in shape to play it. Not that some golfers aren't in great shape, and some may (like Tiger) be pretty buff.

But compare them and Tiger too to the best athletes in basketball, tennis, track & field, skill position football players, gymnasts, soccer players, etc. I see no basis to put him in the top 50 athletes in the US, much less the planet. He is the greatest golf game player on the planet, and I admire his playing through the knee pain ... but that proves nothing with respect to being the "best athlete on the planet". I've personally seen football players playing through a lot more pain than that (and in a contact sport), and that doesn't prove they're the greatest either.

Sorry RPS, I think you're way off on this one.

[Hoser]

God, I hate Tiger Woods. Well maybe not *him*, just the idiot sports writers fawn over his every move. Here's to whomever he's playing today kicks his tail.

When Tiger Woods is not in a tournament number of viewers goes down big time. He may not truly be the best athlete on the planet but he is probably the most powerful single person determining TV ratings.

The guy keeps pulling rabbits out of his hat and making huge shots and putts to win. When Tiger speaks TV execs listen.

[BrokenArrowLobo]

Tiger is a great athlete in a sport full of non athletes. I was given tickets to the PGA championship last year and went at 6 AM to see him practice, and he was already done. It was 105 that week and he won going away because he was the only one who was in shape.
He is not a great athlete like Jordan or any of the greats, but he money. Golf is not a sport that can be conquered, and his consistency and making that put yesterday were amazing. I am not a golf fan, but I recognize greatness.

[loborick]

Best golfer, yes. Best athlete on the planet? Not even in the ballpark.

Golf is a tough "game" but requires no great strength, no speed, no thowing or jumping, or great coordination. You don't even have to be in shape to play it. Not that some golfers aren't in great shape, and some may (like Tiger) be pretty buff.

But compare them and Tiger too to the best athletes in basketball, tennis, track & field, skill position football players, gymnasts, soccer players, etc. I see no basis to put him in the top 50 athletes in the US, much less the planet. He is the greatest golf game player on the planet, and I admire his playing through the knee pain ... but that proves nothing with respect to being the "best athlete on the planet". I've personally seen football players playing through a lot more pain than that (and in a contact sport), and that doesn't prove they're the greatest either.

Sorry RPS, I think you're way off on this one.

God, I hate Tiger Woods. Well maybe not *him*, just the idiot sports writers fawn over his every move. Here's to whomever he's playing today kicks his tail.

Ditto to both. Tiger is the best golfer right now. The best of all time? I don't know about that. He doesn't have the kind of competition that was around in the late 70s and 80s. But best athlete? He works out...but could he play a 90 minute soccer game? Could he play a 40 minute full court basketball game? I have had four knee surgeries. I can understand the pain he is having. But if I were playing for the kind of money he is, I could play through that pain. His surgery was fairly routine. I have had my patellar tendon re-aligned, which involved much more than arthroscopy. But you see guys play with broken bones and other severe injuries in other sports. And I just can't consider a golfer the best athlete. He is buffed...that doesn't make him a athlete, much less the best.

And I don't believe Tiger is good for golf, he is good for Tiger. What happens if Tiger is injured and has to retire? Are the people that are turning on golf now going to continue? No. People either love or hate him, so they watch to either root for him or against him. I like to follow all sports, but it drives me crazy if I'm watching ESPN and they talk about Tiger for five minutes before they even mention who is actually leading the tournament. That makes me resentful of him and I end up rooting against him just so the media can stick their microphones up their....noses. So....go Rocco!!!!!!

[LIDOakaLJT]

Ditto to both. Tiger is the best golfer right now. The best of all time? I don't know about that. He doesn't have the kind of competition that was around in the late 70s and 80s. But best athlete? He works out...but could he play a 90 minute soccer game? Could he play a 40 minute full court basketball game? I have had four knee surgeries. I can understand the pain he is having. But if I were playing for the kind of money he is, I could play through that pain. His surgery was fairly routine. I have had my patellar tendon re-aligned, which involved much more than arthroscopy.

And I don't believe Tiger is good for golf, he is good for Tiger. What happens if Tiger is injured and has to retire? Are the people that are turning on golf now going to continue? No. People either love or hate him, so they watch to either root for him or against him. I like to follow all sports, but it drives me crazy if I'm watching ESPN and they talk about Tiger for five minutes before they even mention who is actually leading the tournament. That makes me resentful of him and I end up rooting against him just so the media can stick their microphones up their....noses. So....go Rocco!!!!!!

Don't be such a hater Loborick --- it isn't a pretty look on you!!! LOL!!!

Seriously though, how can you possibly say that Tiger is not good for golf --- are you crazy?!?!?! It's because of him that golf is enjoying its highest viewer-ship.....EVER!!! Like others have said, either you love him or hate him but that "feeling" is what gets viewers to a sport that wouldn't have much attention without him. Similar guys in their professions would include Beckham in soccer and McEnroe in tennis (Federer & Nadal now).

As for the competition comment, I think you're way off on that one as well....maybe if guys like Mickelson, Els, Singh, etc would concentrate on their game and their personal health, they'd be better competition but you can't say Tiger doesn't have competition. I bet if Nicklaus or Watson had been as motivated as Tiger, they would have dominated their eras that much more (making it appears as though they didn't have competition either).

Okay, enough of that.....

GO TIGER, GO CARDINAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :-)

[BrokenArrowLobo]

Of course Tiger is good for golf. We are talking about him. I am not a golf fan and probably most of us in this thread are not. Even if we hate him, he's good for golf because he gets people talking. Even my dad who hates golf watched the end of it yesterday.

[Catcus Jim]

God, I hate Tiger Woods. Well maybe not *him*, just the idiot sports writers fawn over his every move. Here's to whomever he's playing today kicks his tail.

I don`t hate Tiger at all. Tiger is most certainly the very best golfer playing today, and most likely of all time, but what the media has done, is ruin coverage of golf for me. They spend most of their time in promoting Tiger and little time covering the tournament. What a stroy to have a man in his mid forties, hasn`t won in years, and that has had so much of his body rebuilt, find a way to suck it up and be in a playoff with the best golfer in the world. $$$$

[loborick]

I don't agree that Tiger is good for the game of golf. He is attracting attention to the game right now. But, like I said, as soon as Tiger is gone, so is this attention. It's like when people have talked about in the past when the US has done well in the World Cup that soccer would explode. It didn't. When the WC ended, so did all the attention.

It drove me crazy this morning that everyone was pretty much discounting any chance Rocco had.

[loboray]

I rooted for Rocco, but knew Tiger would find a way to win. I think he is obsessed with winning and agree it is all about Tiger. I agree with Lobo Rick that a lot of the fans will not follow the sport when he retires. They are obsessed with his winning. Ever notice how Yankee fans come out of the closet when the Yankees are winning? I am not ready to crown him the best all time yet. May eventually happen though. He is without doubt the best right now.

[loborick]

I rooted for Rocco, but knew Tiger would find a way to win. I think he is obsessed with winning and agree it is all about Tiger. I agree with Lobo Rick that a lot of the fans will not follow the sport when he retires. They are obsessed with his winning. Ever notice how Yankee fans come out of the closet when the Yankees are winning? I am not ready to crown him the best all time yet. May eventually happen though. He is without doubt the best right now.

Ditto, Ray. I was thinking I was going to have to set up a shrine for Tiger in my house the way they were talking about him on SC this afternoon. Geez. He took 91 holes to beat the 156th ranked player in the world and he's a god?

[LoBo LoCo]

Ditto, Ray. I was thinking I was going to have to set up a shrine for Tiger in my house the way they were talking about him on SC this afternoon. Geez. He took 91 holes to beat the 156th ranked player in the world and he's a god?

On a bumm knee...I think that's pretty d@mn good in my opinion. What no one can disqualify is that tourney after tourney...it's always some player like VJ, Mickelson, Westwood, the list could go on and Tiger at the end...ALWAYS. You can't tell me that's a fluke...the guy is majorly talented and some people should just stop being haters. Tiger will make putts and shots in 3 inch rough that are simply incredible. Not to mention his work ethic is second to none.
'

[LoBo LoCo]

Also, Tiger is the best at what he does...who cares about best athlete EVER...give Michael Jordan a basketball in his prime and he was the best ever. But have you seen the guy swing a golf club? Lance Armstrong...simply incredible considering the circumstances. Could he compete on a pro golf circuit...probably not.

[Lobo_for_life]

of time in my younger days playing other sports and was decent in basketball, baseball, and tennis. Please understand, that one reason Tiger Woods is the greatest golfer in the world and will probably end up being considered the best ever is that he is very athletic. Although I'm certain that Woods (with a good knee) possesses classic athleticism (speed, strength, and coordination), his rare combination of strength and precision-like coordination allow him to not only hit strength-requiring shots like 350 yard drives and shots out of deep rough, but also "tweek" shots like "fades" and "draws" from the tee or on any other place on the course.

As for myself, I'm a decent player, probably an 11-handicapper. However, an uninformed person could falsely think that an 11-handicapper is probably, on average, only 13 to 14strokes "less good" than a good pro. Nothing could be further from the truth. The pros are shooting good scores on longer, "tricked-up" courses than a "decent" amateur normally plays. I'd be lucky to shoot 100 on most of the courses those guys are playing on, and they're routinely shooting 68's and 70's. So, as for the level of athleticism required to be THAT good, it is SUBSTANTIAL. While I may still sometimes have some of the so-called "precision-like" physical coordination, if I hit a 260 yard drive I've really hammered it. By comparison, Rocco Mediate is one of the shortest hitters on the tour and he still AVERAGES 280 - 285 off the tee. And Tiger, of course, ......

Finally, as for GREAT golf not requiring GREAT athleticism, that's just plain horsecrap. You've got to play it to understand it.

[loborick]

of time in my younger days playing other sports and was decent in basketball, baseball, and tennis. Please understand, that one reason Tiger Woods is the greatest golfer in the world and will probably end up being considered the best ever is that he is very athletic. Although I'm certain that Woods (with a good knee) possesses classic athleticism (speed, strength, and coordination), his rare combination of strength and precision-like coordination allow him to not only hit strength-requiring shots like 350 yard drives and shots out of deep rough, but also "tweek" shots like "fades" and "draws" from the tee or on any other place on the course.

As for myself, I'm a decent player, probably an 11-handicapper. However, an uninformed person could falsely think that an 11-handicapper is probably, on average, only 13 to 14strokes "less good" than a good pro. Nothing could be further from the truth. The pros are shooting good scores on longer, "tricked-up" courses than a "decent" amateur normally plays. I'd be lucky to shoot 100 on most of the courses those guys are playing on, and they're routinely shooting 68's and 70's. So, as for the level of athleticism required to be THAT good, it is SUBSTANTIAL. While I may still sometimes have some of the so-called "precision-like" physical coordination, if I hit a 260 yard drive I've really hammered it. By comparison, Rocco Mediate is one of the shortest hitters on the tour and he still AVERAGES 280 - 285 off the tee. And Tiger, of course, ......

Finally, as for GREAT golf not requiring GREAT athleticism, that's just plain horsecrap. You've got to play it to understand it.

You have to be athletic to play any sport well. But the best athlete in the world? No way. Of course golf requires some athleticism, but not anywhere near as much as sports like hockey, soccer and basketball. John Daly is a fat slob and could kick any of our butts.

[pjamj]

Wow, what a bunch of haters!

Tiger is absolutely amazing, love him or hate him, the guy gets it done. He is the best of the best, no one even comes close to him, in any sport.

[NMStorm]

I agree with Rick and the others. Tiger is the best golfer in the world but not even remotely close to the best athlete. I laugh when I hear this claim being made. In all seriousness, I don't know how anyone could even consider this.

[wallyhopp]

Bo jackson, greatest athlete ever.

[COLOLOBO]

Basketball players are the very best athletes in world bar none. Other sports are amazed at a 30-35 vertical and many NBA players are between 35 and 40. Most NBA point guards can run a faster 40 dribbling a basketball then the normal pro athletes can run a 40 and don't even talk about running backwards.
With that said other sports have their specialties like baseball players have the best hand eye coordination, soccer players have the best footwork, etc. but for over all athleticism basketball wins it hands down!!

[ThickLobo]

Tiger Woods = greatest athlete? I wouldn't say that. Greatest competitor? You bet!

:NW

[UNM_ALUM]

The best of all time? He doesn't have the kind of competition that was around in the late 70s and 80s. Could he play a 90 minute soccer game? Could he play a 40 minute full court basketball game?

And I don't believe Tiger is good for golf, he is good for Tiger. What happens if Tiger is injured and has to retire? Are the people that are turning on golf now going to continue? No. People either love or hate him, so they watch to either root for him or against him. I like to follow all sports, but it drives me crazy if I'm watching ESPN and they talk about Tiger for five minutes before they even mention who is actually leading the tournament. That makes me resentful of him and I end up rooting against him just so the media can stick their microphones up their....noses. So....go Rocco!!!!!!

Interesting comments there Rick. Do you have some facts for the competition today compared to the 70s and 80s? Maybe you could start by comparing the top 150 players today to then.

Can Kobe bend a soccer ball like Beckham? Can Kobe stay on his feet when trying to block a blitzing Merriman? Can Kobe hit a 100 mph fastball? Can Kobe return a Roddick serve? Obviously, none of those guys can come close to accomplishing what Kobe can do with a basketball.

You guys can argue all day about whether golf is a sport. There is one thing you can not deny and that is Tiger's greatness. When it is all said and done his greatness will probably surpass every other athlete. You can hate all you want, but at some point you have to go with it and just say at least I got to witness this level of greatness.

[LIDOakaLJT]

You guys can argue all day about whether golf is a sport. There is one thing you can not deny and that is Tiger's greatness. When it is all said and done his greatness will probably surpass every other athlete. You can hate all you want, but at some point you have to go with it and just say at least I got to witness this level of greatness.

Here's my measure of Tiger's true greatness --- he transcends his own sport. Very few great athletes can have that said about them.

Many out there have no clue about golf but they certainly know who "Tiger" is....


GO LOBOS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Catcus Jim]

Interesting comments there Rick. Do you have some facts for the competition today compared to the 70s and 80s? Maybe you could start by comparing the top 150 players today to then.

Can Kobe bend a soccer ball like Beckham? Can Kobe stay on his feet when trying to block a blitzing Merriman? Can Kobe hit a 100 mph fastball? Can Kobe return a Roddick serve?

You guys can argue all day about whether golf is a sport. There is one thing you can not deny and that is Tiger's greatness. When it is all said and done his greatness will probably surpass every other athlete. You can hate all you want, but at some point you have to go with it and just say at least I got to witness this level of greatness.

Question Alum. Why does everyone have to be a hater that disagrees with the hype surrounding Tiger. The guy is the best in his field, is extremly well spoken, hasn`t forgotten his roots, and seems to be a good family man. I can see nothing to hate about those things. Now, everyone has their own description of athletic, but he has great eye-hand coordination, tremendous physical stamina, and the mental toughness of a lion. To me thats athleticism at least in one form.
My objection is the hype of the media ( not Tiger ) that spends nine tenths of the golf match on Tiger. Altho Tiger is the best, there are other great golfers that should be covered without every sentence having to contain "Tiger" in it. By beiny the best, he should receive the lions share of the coverage, just not all of it.

[Roob]

Question Alum. Why does everyone have to be a hater that disagrees with the hype surrounding Tiger. The guy is the best in his field, is extremly well spoken, hasn`t forgotten his roots, and seems to be a good family man. I can see nothing to hate about those things. Now, everyone has their own description of athletic, but he has great eye-hand coordination, tremendous physical stamina, and the mental toughness of a lion. To me thats athleticism at least in one form.
My objection is the hype of the media ( not Tiger ) that spends nine tenths of the golf match on Tiger. Altho Tiger is the best, there are other great golfers that should be covered without every sentence having to contain "Tiger" in it. By beiny the best, he should receive the lions share of the coverage, just not all of it.

The media always hypes the star attractions. Whenever the Broncos played the Dolphins back in the 80's and 90's, the focus was on Elway and Marino, to the exlusion of the other 98 players on the field. Today if the Bears play whatever team, you see a bunch of Urlacher highlights and interviews. They're out to sell tickets and interest in the event. Urlacher may provide 15% of his teams tackles, but he gets 90%+ of the coverage in the pre-game talk, yet I doubt that others on this board hate the media for doing that to Urlacher's teammates who are largely neglected.

[loboray]

Hmm. The media constantly denies they are shills for certain teams and athletes. We know better though don't we?
Tiger is the benefit of great press, and has an extra following of "fans" who love a winner. Saying this though doesn't mean I hate Tiger. Not at all. I respect him for his golf ability. BTW for those of you who don't think the old timers wouldn't have scored better with todays equipment, you are smoking something.

[Bloo]

The media always hypes the star attractions. Whenever the Broncos played the Dolphins back in the 80's and 90's, the focus was on Elway and Marino, to the exlusion of the other 98 players on the field. Today if the Bears play whatever team, you see a bunch of Urlacher highlights and interviews. They're out to sell tickets and interest in the event. Urlacher may provide 15% of his teams tackles, but he gets 90%+ of the coverage in the pre-game talk, yet I doubt that others on this board hate the media for doing that to Urlacher's teammates who are largely neglected.

98 players on the field besides Marino and Elway? So they played football 50 against 50 in the 80s and 90s, Roob?

The only game in the 80s or 90s that I remember even close to that was the 1982 Cal-Stanford game, although some of the "players" were dressed as band members, and I think all of those were representing Stanford, so it was probably more like 89 versus 11. A large, large majority of the other football games I've watched, 80s and 90s included, featured 11 men per side, at least by the time the play began.

[Roob]

98 players on the field besides Marino and Elway? So they played football 50 against 50 in the 80s and 90s, Roob?

The only game in the 80s or 90s that I remember even close to that was the 1982 Cal-Stanford game, although some of the "players" were dressed as band members, and I think all of those were representing Stanford, so it was probably more like 89 versus 11. A large, large majority of the other football games I've watched, 80s and 90s included, featured 11 men per side, at least by the time the play began.

Hey, I'm talking about the pre-game hype there bloosey. Last time I looked about 49 players from each side took the field during the pre-game warmups. Quit hatin'.

[loborick]

I haven't seen anyone "hate" on Tiger. I think the consensus is he is the best golfer around right now. Whether he is the best of all time is an argument that is common in every sport. And everyone has their own definition of athlete.

I actually think it would have been much better for the sport of golf if Rocco would have won yesterday. Underdogs have a way of lifting interest.

So, go ahead and slam me for my "hating".