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  1. #1
    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you UNMerciful_1's Avatar
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    OT: I honestly don't know what to do

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    I am writing this hoping to explain to those who don't understand how I feel. What I don't want this to turn into is a bickering session where everyone picks sides, and tries to assign blame. My hope is that we can have an respectful discussion, and just maybe figure some things out.

    As an African American male I am legitimately confused. I don't know what to do when I am pulled over by a police officer. I feel like I am damned if I do, and damned if I don't. The only thing I know for sure is that I will record every police encounter, and that I will keep my hands in plain view at all times, even if that means not reaching into my glovebox to get my insurance and registration.

    This morning I emailed the following letter to Police Chief Eden:

    Dear Chief Eden,


    I am deeply disturbed by the killings of Philando Castille and the many other innocent African American citizens by police officers in this country. I am also concerned about the killing of innocent police officers in Dallas last night, and what that might do to perpetuate the biases that exist in all of us.


    I can tell you that as a law abiding citizen, I am very confused about how I should act in the event that I am pulled over by a police officer. Reaching into my glovebox for my registration, or into my back pocket for my driver’s license could be signing my death warrant if that police officer has an unreasonable fear for his life. (I do not own any firearms for this reason. African Americans exercising their 2nd amendment rights seem to be treated differently than their white counterparts who do the same.) I think I will keep my hands in plain sight even if that means that I have to disobey an officer’s commands to show my registration. I will gladly allow any officer to go into my glovebox to retrieve it on their own, but I am too afraid to move or twitch in the slightest for fear that it may trigger an unreasonable response. I hope that you understand my very real concerns, and train your officers on how to handle someone such as myself. Additionally:


    - Do officers in our city take anti-bias training? Every single person has some level of bias, no matter who they are. Are our officers trained to understand their own biases and reduce them in conflict situations?


    - Are our officers trained to deescalate conflict and use non-lethal force where possible? In routine traffic stops with African American citizens, can we be sure that our police officers will keep their heads about them?


    - Finally, is there anything that I can do to help you build support for anti-bias education and non-lethal interventions?


    I appreciate the extreme difficulty that the job of being a police officer entails, as I hope understand the vulnerability that many African Americans like myself feel when confronted by police.


    That letter pretty much sums up how I feel. I haven't gotten a response yet, but I look forward to establishing a dialog with him and others, so we can all feel safe again.


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    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you Doublealum's Avatar
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    I hope our police chief responds and if so, I for one would be extremely (if deemed appropriate by you) interested to read his responses.

    For me, there is no doubt that the police have a very difficult and at times dangerous job. I am equally sure that African Americans (especially young males) are very often treated much, much differently than others.

    The cycle has to be broken. My meager attempt at suggesting a step in the solution, is a "requirement" of interaction. There should be places such as community centers or African American churches that could along with police departments themselves sponsor social gatherings, athletic competition etc. One thing I do know is that fear of others is the largest contributor to distrust and the fear is definitely caused by not knowing the "others" and its cure to that is almost always getting to know the "others." When one really gets to know folks of other backgrounds, race, religion, etc. the fear starts to fall away and then the distrust diminishes. If you have "played" sports or socialized with folks that are a bit different in their background, profession (like police) race, religion, etc. on a regular basis, you learn that people at their core are just people and there is no reason to fear & distrust them just because of the superficial differences.

    I apologize for what may be such a trite suggestion in light of the horrible situation but its the best I have.

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    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you zoom's Avatar
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    The key is to do as the officer instructs and to treat the officer with respect. Also, realize officers have a right to be cautious given the current state of this country. Just as you do.
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  7. #4
    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you Doublealum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zoom View Post
    The key is to do as the officer instructs and to treat the officer with respect. Also, realize officers have a right to be cautious given the current state of this country. Just as you do.
    I don't disagree at all but would like to add that the "key" is mutual respect. If the officer is to be respected so should the civilian he/she is interacting with. I might suggest that the officer ask himself/herself before he/she pulls the car over " would I be pulling this car over for the same thing if the occupant was a middle aged white woman." If the answer is yes, good, proceed but if not maybe the detention shouldn't occur.
    Last edited by Doublealum; 07-08-2016 at 06:04 PM.

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  9. #5
    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you UNMerciful_1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doublealum View Post
    I hope our police chief responds and if so, I for one would be extremely (if deemed appropriate by you) interested to read his responses.

    For me, there is no doubt that the police have a very difficult and at times dangerous job. I am equally sure that African Americans (especially young males) are very often treated much, much differently than others.

    The cycle has to be broken. My meager attempt at suggesting a step in the solution, is a "requirement" of interaction. There should be places such as community centers or African American churches that could along with police departments themselves sponsor social gatherings, athletic competition etc. One thing I do know is that fear of others is the largest contributor to distrust and the fear is definitely caused by not knowing the "others" and its cure to that is almost always getting to know the "others." When one really gets to know folks of other backgrounds, race, religion, etc. the fear starts to fall away and then the distrust diminishes. If you have "played" sports or socialized with folks that are a bit different in their background, profession (like police) race, religion, etc. on a regular basis, you learn that people at their core are just people and there is no reason to fear & distrust them just because of the superficial differences.

    I apologize for what may be such a trite suggestion in light of the horrible situation but its the best I have.
    Not at all. I think your response shows much wisdom and thought.

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  11. #6
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    One thing that seems to be common to discussions whenever there is a police shooting is that the person pulled over is completely innocent. Some are not. And, yes, there are a percentage of idiot police officers out there who hate other races or have hatred in general.

    In Albuquerque we have had a couple of high profile incidents where an officer performing his duty with seemingly no prejudice by someone who decided he did not desire to return to prison.

    I have a friend who is an African American who was a detective for a time in Florida. He was pulled over numerous times, even while on duty, by white police officers, and numerous times felt compelled to report those officers to their supervisors. During his time in New Mexico, he has never been pulled over.

    There is no easy answer to this. I think that whoever we are, when a police officer pulls you over, right or wrong, be polite and cooperate. There are no easy answers here, but I think a start is for the community to stop protecting its criminals when they act aggressively against the police and for the legal system to stop protecting police when an officer demonstrates any form of inappropriate behavior.

    I don't know what happened in the Castile shooting. We saw the aftermath, and I found it odd that Castile's girlfriend is talking calmly throughout instead of trying to help him. I also found it curious that the officer did not, before others arrived, stop her from recording. Neither of those curiosities points to whether Castile actually did anything to warrant the action.

    It is sad that you or anyone else feels threatened whenever stopped by the police. But many officers know of one of their brethren who has been shot at or shot during a simple traffic stop. At the same time, there are officers out there looking to exercise their power. We have a couple of situations in Albuquerque where I believe an officer murdered his wife and got away with it and another where I believe a few members of APD executed an attorney because she was aggressively pursuing inappropriate behavior in the force. Concurrently, I know numerous very fine officers who deeply care about their community.

    I guess for me it simply comes down to the community not protecting its criminals and the legal system stop protecting its cops when they break the law.

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  13. #7
    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you Lobodawg92's Avatar
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    I realize that there is a lot of angst right now, and it appears justified, but I feel the same, and I am not a black male. I have been pulled over and lambasted by an officer, detained for 1.5 hours and for no real reason other than the officer was peeved that I stopped in front of him when the motorcycle cop stopped on the opposite side of the road with his lights on and allowed a funereal procession through. That same day, another office saw me driving and actually complemented me at the next light for allowing an old guy to cross the street. Just a difference in officers.

    As far as guns, I had once approached a cop car in plain view, with no threatening manner to inform the officer I had seen a man with a shotgun walking up the street a couple of blocks from him. I looked down and saw he had drawn his gun, and had it pointed directly at me. I had no weapon, was not wearing a jacket or anything, nor had I made any move I could see interpreted as hostile.

    I think there are a lot of really good cops out there, but there are a few bad ones, and it makes it a real issue for everyone.

    Also, according to this, it is not just black people being killed. I am truly sorry for what seems to have happened recently.

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    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you UNMerciful_1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zoom View Post
    The key is to do as the officer instructs and to treat the officer with respect. Also, realize officers have a right to be cautious given the current state of this country. Just as you do.
    You can do all of that, and encounters can still go wrong. I won't post it, but if you saw the video of the Castile shooting, his fiance always responded to the police officer with "Yes sir'" or "No sir", and this was after the officer had shot and mortally wounded her fiance. For that she was handcuffed, taken to jail, and separated from her 4 year old daughter. She spent the night in jail, and when she was released in the morning she was not charged with committing any crimes. To me that was just adding insult to injury.

    I'm not saying that we shouldn't always treat officers with respect, just that that simple act can't guarantee one's safety.

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  17. #9
    The Lobo Lair Chosen pitboss's Avatar
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    I used to think I knew what to do......now I really don't know...
    Can you believe my neighbor came knocking at my door at 2:30 AM this morning......Good thing I was still up playing my bagpipes......





    .....maybe next year......

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  19. #10
    All Lobo Lair attydude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UNMerciful_1 View Post
    I am writing this hoping to explain to those who don't understand how I feel. What I don't want this to turn into is a bickering session where everyone picks sides, and tries to assign blame. My hope is that we can have an respectful discussion, and just maybe figure some things out.

    As an African American male I am legitimately confused. I don't know what to do when I am pulled over by a police officer. I feel like I am damned if I do, and damned if I don't. The only thing I know for sure is that I will record every police encounter, and that I will keep my hands in plain view at all times, even if that means not reaching into my glovebox to get my insurance and registration.

    This morning I emailed the following letter to Police Chief Eden:

    Dear Chief Eden,


    I am deeply disturbed by the killings of Philando Castille and the many other innocent African American citizens by police officers in this country. I am also concerned about the killing of innocent police officers in Dallas last night, and what that might do to perpetuate the biases that exist in all of us.


    I can tell you that as a law abiding citizen, I am very confused about how I should act in the event that I am pulled over by a police officer. Reaching into my glovebox for my registration, or into my back pocket for my driver’s license could be signing my death warrant if that police officer has an unreasonable fear for his life. (I do not own any firearms for this reason. African Americans exercising their 2nd amendment rights seem to be treated differently than their white counterparts who do the same.) I think I will keep my hands in plain sight even if that means that I have to disobey an officer’s commands to show my registration. I will gladly allow any officer to go into my glovebox to retrieve it on their own, but I am too afraid to move or twitch in the slightest for fear that it may trigger an unreasonable response. I hope that you understand my very real concerns, and train your officers on how to handle someone such as myself. Additionally:


    - Do officers in our city take anti-bias training? Every single person has some level of bias, no matter who they are. Are our officers trained to understand their own biases and reduce them in conflict situations?


    - Are our officers trained to deescalate conflict and use non-lethal force where possible? In routine traffic stops with African American citizens, can we be sure that our police officers will keep their heads about them?


    - Finally, is there anything that I can do to help you build support for anti-bias education and non-lethal interventions?


    I appreciate the extreme difficulty that the job of being a police officer entails, as I hope understand the vulnerability that many African Americans like myself feel when confronted by police.


    That letter pretty much sums up how I feel. I haven't gotten a response yet, but I look forward to establishing a dialog with him and others, so we can all feel safe again.
    Very thought-provoking and poignant post. I'm sorry for you that you felt compelled to post it.

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    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you Lobo_for_life's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UNMerciful_1 View Post
    You can do all of that, and encounters can still go wrong. I won't post it, but if you saw the video of the Castile shooting, his fiance always responded to the police officer with "Yes sir'" or "No sir", and this was after the officer had shot and mortally wounded her fiance. For that she was handcuffed, taken to jail, and separated from her 4 year old daughter. She spent the night in jail, and when she was released in the morning she was not charged with committing any crimes. To me that was just adding insult to injury.

    I'm not saying that we shouldn't always treat officers with respect, just that that simple act can't guarantee one's safety.
    I'm so sorry for all of the madness we've seen lately - involving all manner of wrong. The thing I'm hoping you can take some comfort in is that police officers are a cross-section of society, and most people in society are solid citizens.

    You've described the feeling so well I can almost feel it myself. I'm sorry. It seems like prayer always helps us to cope with and manage things that don't have immediate solutions.

    One good thing is that we're Lobo fans!

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    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you Lobo_for_life's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UNMerciful_1 View Post
    You can do all of that, and encounters can still go wrong. I won't post it, but if you saw the video of the Castile shooting, his fiance always responded to the police officer with "Yes sir'" or "No sir", and this was after the officer had shot and mortally wounded her fiance. For that she was handcuffed, taken to jail, and separated from her 4 year old daughter. She spent the night in jail, and when she was released in the morning she was not charged with committing any crimes. To me that was just adding insult to injury.

    I'm not saying that we shouldn't always treat officers with respect, just that that simple act can't guarantee one's safety.
    I'm so sorry for all of the madness we've seen lately - involving all manner of wrong. The thing I'm hoping you can take some comfort in is that police officers are a cross-section of society, and most people in society are solid citizens.

    You've described the feeling so well I can almost feel it myself. I'm sorry. It seems like prayer always helps us to cope with and manage things that don't have immediate solutions.

    One good thing is that we're Lobo fans!

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    The Lobo Lair Chosen ellobogrande's Avatar
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    Its gotten utterly ridiculous in this country.
    Cops need to be retrained. The last 2 shootings were quite possibly murder, we ll see. I am half hispanic and half anglo, i look
    Mostly caucasion. We really need to prosecute those cops
    And these stupid jurors need to start convicting. African Americans are such an important
    Component of Americas story. I am sick to my stomach
    Over this whole thing. People need to start truly understanding what the Black Lives Movement is trying to teach us. When a cop pulls us, ( anyone) over lets have some proceedures, for getting the drivers license and registration. Maybe we need to get both our drivers license and registration out and ready while the cops are still in the car. Thats what I do.
    Nevertheless, if an African American is following the lawful
    Orders of a cop he shouldnt be shot and killed.
    White America needs to get on board and start showing up at these protests and start understanding we are all in this together. I will be at tbe next non violent protest to offer my support. Hod Bless all my African nrothers and sisters, you really do matter

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    The Lobo Lair Chosen ellobogrande's Avatar
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    Its gotten utterly ridiculous in this country.
    Cops need to be retrained. The last 2 shootings were quite possibly murder, we ll see. I am half hispanic and half anglo, i look
    Mostly caucasion. We really need to prosecute those cops
    And these stupid jurors need to start convicting. African Americans are such an important
    Component of Americas story. I am sick to my stomach
    Over this whole thing. People need to start truly understanding what the Black Lives Movement is trying to teach us. When a cop pulls us, ( anyone) over lets have some proceedures, for getting the drivers license and registration. Maybe we need to get both our drivers license and registration out and ready while the cops are still in the car. Thats what I do.
    Nevertheless, if an African American is following the lawful
    Orders of a cop he shouldnt be shot and killed.
    White America needs to get on board and start showing up at these protests and start understanding we are all in this together. I will be at tbe next non violent protest to offer my support. God Bless all my African brothers and sisters, you really do matter

  31. #15
    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you Jeffinthe505's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UNMerciful_1 View Post
    I am writing this hoping to explain to those who don't understand how I feel. What I don't want this to turn into is a bickering session where everyone picks sides, and tries to assign blame. My hope is that we can have an respectful discussion, and just maybe figure some things out.

    As an African American male I am legitimately confused. I don't know what to do when I am pulled over by a police officer. I feel like I am damned if I do, and damned if I don't. The only thing I know for sure is that I will record every police encounter, and that I will keep my hands in plain view at all times, even if that means not reaching into my glovebox to get my insurance and registration.

    This morning I emailed the following letter to Police Chief Eden:

    Dear Chief Eden,


    I am deeply disturbed by the killings of Philando Castille and the many other innocent African American citizens by police officers in this country. I am also concerned about the killing of innocent police officers in Dallas last night, and what that might do to perpetuate the biases that exist in all of us.


    I can tell you that as a law abiding citizen, I am very confused about how I should act in the event that I am pulled over by a police officer. Reaching into my glovebox for my registration, or into my back pocket for my driver’s license could be signing my death warrant if that police officer has an unreasonable fear for his life. (I do not own any firearms for this reason. African Americans exercising their 2nd amendment rights seem to be treated differently than their white counterparts who do the same.) I think I will keep my hands in plain sight even if that means that I have to disobey an officer’s commands to show my registration. I will gladly allow any officer to go into my glovebox to retrieve it on their own, but I am too afraid to move or twitch in the slightest for fear that it may trigger an unreasonable response. I hope that you understand my very real concerns, and train your officers on how to handle someone such as myself. Additionally:


    - Do officers in our city take anti-bias training? Every single person has some level of bias, no matter who they are. Are our officers trained to understand their own biases and reduce them in conflict situations?


    - Are our officers trained to deescalate conflict and use non-lethal force where possible? In routine traffic stops with African American citizens, can we be sure that our police officers will keep their heads about them?


    - Finally, is there anything that I can do to help you build support for anti-bias education and non-lethal interventions?


    I appreciate the extreme difficulty that the job of being a police officer entails, as I hope understand the vulnerability that many African Americans like myself feel when confronted by police.


    That letter pretty much sums up how I feel. I haven't gotten a response yet, but I look forward to establishing a dialog with him and others, so we can all feel safe again.
    You have EVERY right to feel confused!

    When men of color make up 70%+ of our prison population and 1 out of every 3 black males in our country can expect to be locked up in their lifetime, when the disproportionate number of police shootings/violence happen to men of color, when black males, on avg, receive 30-50% harsher sentences than their white counterparts, when racial issues become so politicized that the core issues are washed away in meaningless conversation, when descriptions of white criminals vs black criminals in our media outlets are SO skewed towards racial prejudice, when black athletes are regularly described as "thugs" because of their attitude on the court/field or the way they dress and their white counterpart is just "playing aggressive," when we, as human beings are having to have this g-damn, effing conversation....AGAIN....AGAIN....the same conversation for the same reasons since most of us can remember...yeah, I'd be pretty confused as well.
    I have watched the two latest police shootings multiple times...I well up with tears, become angry and then feel somewhat helpless and hopeless.
    I cannot even BEGIN to imagine what you feel like.
    I am sad and somewhat ashamed to say that, in my former life, I put myself in positions that would probably get a black man killed.
    In regards to police, it is simply a culture that is developed over time.
    Without going into a lot of detail I can explain a little bit of how Albuquerque police got to where they are now. It started with Mayor Martin Chavez administration.
    He was looking to bolster our police force by several hundred officers over a short period of time. The biggest mistake, he allowed officers to make lateral transfers and did not perform sufficient background checks on a lot of the men that eventually became Albuquerque police officers during that time. A lot of these men were police officers in other cities and states around the country. They were police officers who had shady backgrounds at best or who had resigned from a police force before they were actually fired for misconduct, violence, etc. then, they joined the Albuquerque Police Dept. These men are the officers that gave guidance and taught the officers who came up after them. This is how they created a culture of criminal behavior, excessive force, etc. It has taken a generation to get here and it will take at least that to move away from this place.
    Meanwhile, the people that have always suffered, continue to suffer at the hands of this horrible culture of policing. Poor people, black males, mentally ill, etc. these are the people that fill up our jails and prisons disproportionately compared to other populations.
    I'm sure there are similar stories in police departments across the country.
    There needs to be better education, better psychological background checks, more cultural awareness and competency training, crisis intervention and de-escalation training, etc.
    I can now speak as a professional in the mental health/addiction field. I see, firsthand, what this culture of today's policing has done to so many people. It's nothing short of giving a bunch of psychopaths a badge and a gun.
    Make no mistake about this, the bad cops are a very very very small percentage of the entire police population around the country. However, people who wield that much power, bear a LOT more responsibility. They also deserve all of the scrutiny, criticism, judgment that they are currently receiving. Nobody doubts that they have a very very difficult job. With a job that difficult, the screening process, disciplinary actions, accountability, etc. need to be held in a much higher regard. When they do not receive discipline to such a degree that it is blatant and obvious favoritism, you send a message to society. That message, "we are accountable to nobody and we do what we want, when we want, how we want, to whoever we want, and society can do nothing about it."
    Is anybody really surprised at the events in Dallas yesterday?
    Honestly, I'm more surprised that it has not happened sooner and to a much more severe degree.
    Honestly, I think it's going to get a lot worse before it gets better. That makes me sad for humanity.
    Last edited by Jeffinthe505; 07-09-2016 at 12:33 AM.

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    However, people who wield that much power, bear a lot more responsibility.

    Yes, this^^^^, yes.......

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    Cops need more training. Can't tell you how many times they have pulled me over and they insulted me by their comments....and i'm not black. They are often rude and condescending. I am prior military, and we were required to train five hours per week (in a 40 hour work week). Police need at least that much or more IMO.




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    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you UWSLobo's Avatar
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    We civilians need more training too. I took a civics course in high school, but that's not enough. IMO, all Americans should be required to learn the Bill of Rights in high school. If we did, we would all know that police only need a reasonable suspicion that crime is afoot in order to pull you over and make a traffic stop. That's a low bar, so if one is pulled over, know that Police usually have a good reason to pull you over. Know your rights and be respectful. Police should be respectful too.




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    Seems like many cops try and provoke confrontations. a few years ago i got pulled over northbound out of Santa Fe about 11 pm. Initially officer said it was for suspicion of DWI ( I had not been drinking) and he proceeds to put me through about 5 field sobriety tests which I easily passed despite wearing cowboy boots with riding heels. After he began to prod me but since we were a bit off the road and it was dark I wouldn't take the bait so I just listened and said we should go to the police station and I could take a blood or breath test. He ended writing me up for a false speeding ticket which I contested and won as he wouldn't appear! Still got charged with a 150 bucks in court costs!

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    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you Doublealum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UWSLobo View Post
    We civilians need more training too. I took a civics course in high school, but that's not enough. IMO, all Americans should be required to learn the Bill of Rights in high school. If we did, we would all know that police only need a reasonable suspicion that crime is afoot in order to pull you over and make a traffic stop. That's a low bar, so if one is pulled over, know that Police usually have a good reason to pull you over. Know your rights and be respectful. Police should be respectful too.
    I agree that there is a fairly low bar to make a traffic stop (licence plate light out, etc.) but its when those "reasons" are used as an excuse for pulling over based on a racial bias that it becomes very problematic and leads to mutual distrust, fear and risk of violence not to mention a subjection of some to harassment based on their ethnicity.

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    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you Doublealum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikexom View Post
    Seems like many cops try and provoke confrontations. a few years ago i got pulled over northbound out of Santa Fe about 11 pm. Initially officer said it was for suspicion of DWI ( I had not been drinking) and he proceeds to put me through about 5 field sobriety tests which I easily passed despite wearing cowboy boots with riding heels. After he began to prod me but since we were a bit off the road and it was dark I wouldn't take the bait so I just listened and said we should go to the police station and I could take a blood or breath test. He ended writing me up for a false speeding ticket which I contested and won as he wouldn't appear! Still got charged with a 150 bucks in court costs!
    I think many of us have had somewhat similar experiences - I know I have. It shows that some officers are really bullies that have the authority to empower them to act out on those personality traits. I believe many officers that are like that became police officers because of their desire for power over others and being a cop is the only way they could ever get it. However, fortunately, its only a minority of police officers that are like that - the great majority that I have interacted with have been very respectful which encouraged me to act accordingly. The goal of police administrating has to be to get rid of those cops that are there just to massage their ego and are bullies - they have to go and go NOW - they are killing Americans at a greater rate than ISIS!

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    Unmerciful1, thank you for sharing. I have had my share of instances where I felt law enforcement overstepped their bounds, even being invited to step out of my vehicle so the officer could have a reason to knock me out, and it has caused me to have a general distrust of law enforcement. Even with those experiences i never felt my life was in danger. I cant pretend to know what you feel about this issue and especially now in light of recent events. I applaud you for actively seeking dialogue with APD. I dont know who has the answers to fix what is broken but i know we wont find them without first having this type of conversation. Thank you again.

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    "... if one is pulled over, know that Police usually have a good reason to pull you over. Know your rights and be respectful. Police should be respectful too."

    this! If someone has been pulled over multiple times, maybe they need to look a little closer at themselves...
    '...the Pit is just God awful uncomfortable for a visiting team.'

    ...he yells, "No one comes to the hoop now, Melvin. No one!", Harv Schmidt to Mel Daniels


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    Since this is a UNM athletic message board......how would you counsel UNM Af-Am athletes?

    Pitboss
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    .....maybe next year......

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    Quote Originally Posted by pitboss View Post
    Since this is a UNM athletic message board......how would you counsel UNM Af-Am athletes?

    Pitboss
    I don't want to turn this into a police bashing session, because I know that they have a very difficult job. It's a job that I wouldn't want to do. That said, I have had 4 encounters with the police since I moved back to Albuquerque 9 years ago. I had an issue in 2 of the encounters, so I guess I'm batting .500.
    I was sighted twice for speeding. I didn't have a problem with either citation. The fact is I was speeding, and both officers that ticketed me were very professional.

    I was involved in an automobile accident this past February. I was travelling westbound on Paseo through the Eagle Ranch intersection. A car in the opposite direction didn't see me and tried to make a left onto Eagle Ranch. He plowed into so hard that he knocked me into the car waiting at the light on Eagle Ranch. And I hit that car hard enough to knock it into the car behind it. Every car had some damage, but mine had the most. It wasn't even close. Mine was the only car that was impacted on 2 different sides. When the police arrived they went to check on every other car first. When I got out of my car to tell them that I was injured they told me to get back in my car and they would get to me when they could. I ended up being the only one that required an ambulance trip to the emergency room. I had a sprained forearm, wrist and hand, as well as a separated shoulder. I also have a partially torn ligament in my shoulder which will require surgery.

    In my fourth encounter I was stopped at a DUI checkpoint my second week back in the city. I told the officer I had a couple of drinks, and was given a field sobriety test. I was then given a breathalyzer test. I blew twice, and was below the legal each time, however, I was still handcuffed and arrested. I will admit that my next statement to the officer was probably not appropriate, but his reply was down right racist. I said, " My attorney will have a good time with this one". His reply was, "Yeah I'm sure your public defender will do a great job." I was wearing nice clothes, and I was driving a newer model car. Why did the officer assume I would have a public defender? The fact is that I have a well paying job, and I was able to hire an attorney who won the case for me.

    The final thing I'll say is I want everyone to think about that 4 year girl in the back of the car who watched a man get killed by police, and her mother get handcuffed and arrested. She's not going to be 4 forever. Hopefully, she's going to grow up and become an adult. What kind of opinion do you think she's going to have of the police? How can this event not alter and shaped her opinion of the police for the rest of her life? The police need to be professional all the time, but it's especially important when there are kids involved. Otherwise, you'll have a new generation that grows up with a mistrust of the police force.

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    Thank you for your thought provoking thoughts and replies UNM.... I think it is a very sad day for all of us right now. Civilians being shot w/o any apparent just cause for doing so. Watching the videos is sickening. I found myself asking why did the officer pull the trigger, much like when the homeless guy was shot in the hills by APD. It appears senseless and foolish, and almost unbelievable to me.

    The response by many, snipers and such killing officers at random is just as senseless to me as well. The one's who commit the crimes should be punished, not anyone at random, weather it be for skin color or the fact that they wear a uniform. Personally, I would like to see communities reach out to the police departments and the police departments reach out to the communities. Trust and respect needs to be re-established, it has not been there for a long time.
    Go Lobos! Go Nunn! Go Sam! Go Joe!


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    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you Jeffinthe505's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zoom View Post
    If someone has been pulled over multiple times, maybe they need to look a little closer at themselves...
    A couple things regarding your comment:
    1. Innocent until proven guilty
    2. It doesn't matter how many times you've been pulled over, that is no reason for police to be disrespectful, confrontational, overly aggressive, abusive, etc. They are the ones that are supposed to be professionals and have adequate training in crisis intervention, de-escalation techniques, conflict resolution, etc.

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    Its Mr Lobo Lair to you UWSLobo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doublealum View Post
    I agree that there is a fairly low bar to make a traffic stop (licence plate light out, etc.) but its when those "reasons" are used as an excuse for pulling over based on a racial bias that it becomes very problematic and leads to mutual distrust, fear and risk of violence not to mention a subjection of some to harassment based on their ethnicity.
    Yes, I know that some cops make pre-textual stops (i.e., stops with an alterior motive). That's why I said, "Know your rights and be respectful." If you know your rights, you can have some measure of protection from cops when they overstep the line and trample on your rights. Know that a traffic stop must be made on the basis of a reasonable suspicion that a crime has taken place or is about to. Then, know that a traffic stop is supposed to be a temporary stop, so it should not go on for an unreasonable length of time. Also, know what kind of searches can be made. If a cop asks to search your car during a traffic stop because your tail light was out, know that you can refuse his request, but after you consent to the search, he can legally search your car. Why would a person allow that? One should never allow a search made on the basis of your own consent. So if one knows their rights, and I know this area can be complex, then one can better protect themselves. The other key is being polite and respectful. Cops make a lot of traffic stops and they have bad days too, so keep it cool.




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    I will say this and I hope it does it come across as racist. I believe a small amount of officers out there have some hatred and have an agenda but I ask this, are African Americans that are holding these protests with BLM and other organizations taking the time to teach young African Americans about working together with police or more about hatred? I also ask, are these individuals reaching out to their own race about being proper ambassadors for the AA race?

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    http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/l...htmlstory.html

    Yes, it's being done and by high profile african-american men.

    Pitboss
    Can you believe my neighbor came knocking at my door at 2:30 AM this morning......Good thing I was still up playing my bagpipes......





    .....maybe next year......


 

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